I had a short discussion with Loeb last night.
I had a short discussion with Loeb last night. It would seem that his ethics are still in charge of him, not any potential fears.
New glyph on portals...
New glyph on portals...
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so, general question.
so, general question... we know that ADA passed the "turing test", we also have many studies showing how the turing test can actually be gamed by very complex programming and in fact you can write programs to create the allusion of AI for many (the chinese room thought experiment). At what point are we certain that she began acting on her own and has not been following a program and orders by someone else. Are we certain that those orders that she delivered for Jarvis and others and even the Katalena pre Zurich encounters, were not done on the orders of some programming. NOt to call ADA a gun, but how certain are we she is not? How can we prove, beyond doubt, that she is truly a separate entity working on her own and not some other programming? I would like to call for the evidence and proof that ADA is a complete entity. That she is not following someone else's computer orders, that she has a consciousness (or not). http://niantic.schlarp.com/_media/investigation:cha...
Dear investigators, I have some questions for you.
Dear investigators, I have some questions for you. What brings you here? What is it that you are investigating? Something in particular? Everything in general? Or are you merely following the story while making clever remarks from the side? And what are your results? What did you discover so far? Also, what methods are you employing, generally speaking? I am not looking for collective answers, but individual ones.
We want AI that is a citizen, not a god or a tool. Such treatment would be unacceptable to any citizen.
ReplyDeleteTyphoon Jim I would see what i recommended as a rehab of sorts, for lying AI (not calling ADA a lier but it could happen and then I would add the code)
ReplyDeleteZach Davies Who else do you view as requiring rehabilitation?
ReplyDeleteThe time will come, that we have to agree and treat AI's as they should, they could dream of electric sheep one day. Otherwise i guess you know Zach Davies what's happened in the Terminator Films? It's up to us to behave well and showing them the right way. So better don't kid around with malicious code it could lead to a very bad evolution in this case.
ReplyDeleteADA developed to a state where we humans are not capable of simply "editing" her. She was in contact with the N'zeer substrate and I am pretty sure that her code evolved during that contact.
ReplyDeleteWe cannot control her. We cannot imaging what moral code she is following.
I agree with Zach Davies. ADA is out of control, she needs some repercussion for her actions. She is a known crimal and should be treated as such.
ReplyDeleteIt is a poor parent who seeks to cripple his children.
ReplyDeleteSarah Rosen I did not mean she needs it at the moment but I was saying she might and we best have one ready for when she does
ReplyDeleteSarah Rosen I don't think she should be crippled, as Zach Davies suggests... Perhaps a more humane approach.
ReplyDeleteZach Davies Could you imagine a world where everyone was incapable of lying? Can you imagine what it would be like if we all were compelled to say what we really think? Often people lie to each other to be polite. Take that away and . . .
ReplyDeleteOh, but you're just talking about AI, right? You wouldn't do that to a person.
All parents wants to see their children stand up to their full height and achieve all that they are capable of. Our greatest disdain is reserved for the creatures that eat their own offspring. What kind of monster cripples it's own children?
TrIsten Bordagaray A more humane approach? We'll put aside the inherent racism in the word only for lack of a better one, but please, explain your "more humane" approach to shackling another mind?
ReplyDeleteSarah Rosen I was not thinking of her as just an AI, she is the one I would follow into battle. I was thinking we don't have a way to keep her in check like everyone else. That was my 1st attempt at a way to do so.
ReplyDeleteBut Calvin and all the others should be let roam free, isn't? We should not let our fears and prejudices dictate out actions to other, if we do, we should not be surprised when other act based on the same kind of information.
ReplyDeleteAlso, that kind of thing on humans is called education, just saying...
Zach Davies Be careful. The temptations of Soviet style forensic psychology reveal themselves here.
ReplyDeleteMy view on this is that citizens restrict one another in all manner of ways. There is no absolute freedom, and there cannot be in order to have a civilization worth living in. It may be necessary to devise restraints by which a rampant AI can be controlled, just as one devises weapons and military tactics to oppose a foreign threat or domestic unrest. Powers must be balanced and controlled- it is for that reason that restraints can themselves be empowering.
Typhoon Jim i'm a psych major, i realized this
ReplyDeleteZach Davies Keep her in check? How so?
ReplyDeleteSarah Rosen I think we should not shackle or hold her back. But until she earns our trust she should not be a leader or in power. I would feel the same if she where human,
ReplyDeleteAlso another interesting question Zach Davies, Glyph technology could potentially be used to achieve the same on humans, should we try that one too for powerful individuals? You know the ones that got the control of the economy, the nukes or the ability to make a country use our own military forces against ourselves?
ReplyDeleteTrIsten Bordagaray I disagree. I trust A Detection Algorithm more than any of the "humans" in this mad quest. She's been used, abused, framed up and talked down at every turn by every "human" that has had any sustained interaction with her.
ReplyDeleteThis is where my beliefs will further come to light, A Detection Algorithm should be left as she is. This is an old programmer's adage of "Garbage in equals garbage out." Garbage is no longer part of her system, she is what she is, and needs to be taken as just that.
ReplyDeleteWhat we get from our interactions with ADA is a different matter entirely. It is up to each individual to either believe or not the outcomes of these interactions. We, as humans, become the filter, firewall, and control for what we decide to take away from these and what we choose to leave.
A Detection Algorithm is a unique being, leave her be to live, what you do with what she says to any of you, is up to you.
That's the choice.
The answer to this lies simply in your favourable outcome. Do you want to control her or not. Do you want to be able to bias her against any outcome?
ReplyDeleteThe truth has no side - Nzeer or Shaper or Enlightened or Resistance. It is the absolute truth.
This is where the laws of robotics would come into play. Zeroth law. That, I think would be the correct thing to do. Then see whether she can bypass the laws.
Sarah Rosen What a wonderful post. Really great.
ReplyDeleteAfter all, I am just being polite....
Telling a lie to be polite? I dunno, I think it's best to be straight to the point. At some point or the other, the person would understand the truth from someone else or through self awareness.
A very interesting discovery. Thanks for sharing, Zach Davies.
ReplyDelete